Every Cave in Ozark Quadrangle

[RedRook]

USGS lists that there are 42 caves in the Ozark Quadrangle. Anyone know where you can look up all 42 of those caves?

[Nicotti]

Be a well respected cave grotto member.

Seriously. They have the data.

[RedRook]

So far the answers I've gotten are become respected in a cave grotto or volunteer for the USGS. Surely there is a short cut for antisocial people. I mean I'm not talking about going alone, but then I'm not eager to join other groups either.

[Nicotti]

The problem is, in MO at least, it's illegal to make private cave locations available to the public without consent of the land owner (or something like that). So there is no database that you can just look up and query easy-peasy. You have to have an in with the groups or the people that have that info.

[RedRook]

Crazy thing is I can look up directly through the federal information where they think every mine is. I can do the same indirectly with springs, though they bundle the information in a data file. Its interesting they distinguish caves as something different. My in person in the USGS did say something similar to what you did about caves though. Problem is he's in Tennessee, so knowing him really doesn't help me here.

[RedRook]

I'm also highly interested in an area that wouldn't be public land, so in this case I'm not thinking about going into someone's cave. I'm more interested in whether there is a cave where I can freely roam. Maybe they'll get back to me about joining the USGS volunteers.

[jammer_smith]

Yeah, its not easy at all. I've got like, I dunno, I have 180 locations on my caves and karst map, and it has taken me like 4 years of scouring message boards, maps, property listings, groundwater test reports, and historical documents to find all of those.

The information is just super protected. And I understand why of course. All of the well-known and easily accessed caves are totally trashed, cause people are dicks and can't be trusted to not fuck things up for the pure pleasure marring something unmarred.

[RedRook]

I found a single cave in the area, and I found a smaller area that is supposed to have 3 caves. So the one cave I found coordinates for is not the one I'm looking for. The smaller area is supposed to have 3 known caves, half of that area is public. The other half is private. There is only one mobile home on the private land. So I'm getting closer by combing forums. I know there are at least two more caves where I'm looking, but it's a rough area to go looking for two holes in the ground. That'll give me something to do for a few weekends.

[RedRook]

Awesome found the second cave, and read a message that the 2 public caves are closed to the public to protect the bats. The private one does not fall under the same restriction. I'm getting lucky today. So there is one more cave somewhere in there, and it's on private land, great.

[PANIC! on the Titanic]

Yeah, its not easy at all. I've got like, I dunno, I have 180 locations on my caves and karst map, and it has taken me like 4 years of scouring message boards, maps, property listings, groundwater test reports, and historical documents to find all of those.

The information is just super protected. And I understand why of course. All of the well-known and easily accessed caves are totally trashed, cause people are dicks and can't be trusted to not fuck things up for the pure pleasure marring something unmarred.

Pretty much this all the way.

I spend a lot of time cross referencing various sources, old literature and browsing old topos to find shit (although federal caves were removed from topos after The Federal Cave Protection Act of 1988
section 5a. Networking and hard research gets you the info. Furthermore, I can tell you that working for USGS doesn't = cave info. All the cave location files are closely guarded at the Missouri Geological Survey (under DNR), and they don't dish that shit out to just anyone, which I suppose is nice because as jammersmith said, people are dickheads and will ruin shit for the genuinely adventurous with nondestructive intentions.

[Nicotti]

I know people on here like to bash cave grottos, but they aren't really that bad.

This is the Springfield one. Their business meetings are free to attend, I used to do that when I lived down there, sometimes you can glean info from presentations they do.

[PANIC! on the Titanic]

In my experience they've yet to impress me.

It's either "Let's get drunk and crawl in caves!" or "Let's gate every cave!"

When it wasn't those two things, it was "where the hell is this cave?" or "Oops, looks like you're the only one who showed to go caving with us, gofuckyourself."

I'd rather do my own research than deal with that shit again.

[Nicotti]

But, grottos can get in gated caves. In fact many grottos manage gated caves for owners that don't want to have to mess with it.

[RedRook]

In this case, I'm interested in one specific cave. I think I have it narrowed down to one specific owner. The next question is if this owner has electricity, because I can't find their phone number and the aerial photograph makes that actually look unlikely. The next question after that is if they will shoot me if I drive up and try to knock on their door. This should be fun. I managed getting what I needed.

[jammer_smith]

Redrook, if you can PM the Coords of the caves you've found I would dearly love to add it to my map. Coming up on 200 caves in the general Springfield area. Maybe I can crack 200 this year.